[ECON] 2017 DSE經濟科討論區(2)

actual cost of holding money 永遠等於nominal interest rate

講返上面手寫張紙
要分返開個利率係指money定係bond
expected real interest rate用題目資料計係5-2=3, 但呢個係bond既expected real interest rate(return rate)黎
同理, actual bond real interest rate(return rate)係5-4=1
依家題目叫你搵actual cost of holding money, 你係唔可以用bond既real rate直接當做moeny既real rate, 兩個概念黎唔溝得埋
因為money本身假設做冇return, 而bond有return, 而portfolio假設左只可以持有呢兩種財富形式


成個問題應該係, 如果題目問actual cost of holding money, 可唔可以用
actual nominal interest rate去睇, 定係必須要照用expected nominal interest rate睇, 定係兩隻其實概念上冇必別, 仰或數值上兩者其實係相等

real interest rate可以分expected同actual, 咁nominal interest rate又得唔得?
expected nominal interest rate = expected real interest rate + expected inflation rate
咁actual real interest rate + actual inflation rate係咪=actual nominal interest rate??

nominal interest rate 冇分expected同actual

等我幫你清concept啦
嗱，而家你想借錢比人，咁收幾多interest 好？你要訂立一個nominal interest rate, using Fisher Equation:
借錢俾人所訂立的nominal interest rate= 你想收到嘅real interest rate + expected inflation rate

好喇，而家人地還咗錢，你想計下自己收嘅real interest rate 係咪真係你本身想收到嘅real interest rate，using this equation, which IS NOT fisher equation:
realized real interest rate= 訂立左嘅nominal interest rate - actual inflation rate

成個flow就係咁，由頭到尾nominal interest rate 只有一個，就係你自己訂立嗰個～～～～～～～

其實可以當fisher equation有兩條

一條係" 預期版 " 一條係" 真實版 "
預期版' : i = r(e) + △%p (e)
真實版：i =r(a) + △%p(a)
a for actual, e for expected (△%p係通脹率)
咁你做呢d q就只係照單執藥，佢話 expected inflation rate咪△%p (e) 囉。
佢問 real return rate咪 r (a) ,expected ge咪r (e)
唯一要知就人 i仔係 interchangeable in such equations

點解real interest rate可以分actual & expected而nominal interest rate唔得?
所謂冇actual nominal interest rate係咪即係指actual nominal interest rate其實係expected nominal interest rate

借錢比人要簽約（或者agreement啦）年頭定左一個% 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改 唔使分actual/expected nominal interest rate
real有分autual/expected都係因為inflation有actual/expected

如果我借蘋果俾人
年頭定左一個(real)%, 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改, 所以唔使分actual/expected REAL interest rate???

expected即係事前即係今天決定, 如果real interest rate可以今天決定要明天再審視返, 點解nominal interest rate唔得?

講返上面手寫張紙
要分返開個利率係指money定係bond
expected real interest rate用題目資料計係5-2=3, 但呢個係bond既expected real interest rate(return rate)黎
同理, actual bond real interest rate(return rate)係5-4=1
依家題目叫你搵actual cost of holding money, 你係唔可以用bond既real rate直接當做moeny既real rate, 兩個概念黎唔溝得埋
因為money本身假設做冇return, 而bond有return, 而portfolio假設左只可以持有呢兩種財富形式


成個問題應該係, 如果題目問actual cost of holding money, 可唔可以用
actual nominal interest rate去睇, 定係必須要照用expected nominal interest rate睇, 定係兩隻其實概念上冇必別, 仰或數值上兩者其實係相等

real interest rate可以分expected同actual, 咁nominal interest rate又得唔得?
expected nominal interest rate = expected real interest rate + expected inflation rate
咁actual real interest rate + actual inflation rate係咪=actual nominal interest rate??

nominal interest rate 冇分expected同actual

等我幫你清concept啦
嗱，而家你想借錢比人，咁收幾多interest 好？你要訂立一個nominal interest rate, using Fisher Equation:
借錢俾人所訂立的nominal interest rate= 你想收到嘅real interest rate + expected inflation rate

好喇，而家人地還咗錢，你想計下自己收嘅real interest rate 係咪真係你本身想收到嘅real interest rate，using this equation, which IS NOT fisher equation:
realized real interest rate= 訂立左嘅nominal interest rate - actual inflation rate

成個flow就係咁，由頭到尾nominal interest rate 只有一個，就係你自己訂立嗰個～～～～～～～

其實可以當fisher equation有兩條

一條係" 預期版 " 一條係" 真實版 "
預期版' : i = r(e) + △%p (e)
真實版：i =r(a) + △%p(a)
a for actual, e for expected (△%p係通脹率)
咁你做呢d q就只係照單執藥，佢話 expected inflation rate咪△%p (e) 囉。
佢問 real return rate咪 r (a) ,expected ge咪r (e)
唯一要知就人 i仔係 interchangeable in such equations

點解real interest rate可以分actual & expected而nominal interest rate唔得?
所謂冇actual nominal interest rate係咪即係指actual nominal interest rate其實係expected nominal interest rate

借錢比人要簽約（或者agreement啦）年頭定左一個% 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改 唔使分actual/expected nominal interest rate
real有分autual/expected都係因為inflation有actual/expected

如果我借蘋果俾人
年頭定左一個(real)%, 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改, 所以唔使分actual/expected REAL interest rate???

expected即係事前即係今天決定, 如果real interest rate可以今天決定要明天再審視返, 點解nominal interest rate唔得?

巴打concept上好似有啲混淆左兩者
年頭（借錢個時）係份contract到定個個rate一定係nominal interest rate
唔會係real interest rate
你諗下 如果nominal interest rate都可以變 咁fisher equation洗乜搞個real interest rate出黎 直接用nominal加加減減都得啦 就係因為contract/agreement上需要一個唔會變嘅rate(冇理由年頭同人講收10% 年中inflation同佢講哎呀都係要收20% 年尾deflation又轉多次架嘛) 所以先有nominal/real嘅分別

仲有想問下paper one paper two嘅比重點計？係咪由12年到而家都一樣？
費事次次上黎問啲低能野阻住巴打們討論

p1:p2 3:7
唔肯定會唔會好似math咁因應個年份兩份papers嘅難度而稍微調整

講返上面手寫張紙
要分返開個利率係指money定係bond
expected real interest rate用題目資料計係5-2=3, 但呢個係bond既expected real interest rate(return rate)黎
同理, actual bond real interest rate(return rate)係5-4=1
依家題目叫你搵actual cost of holding money, 你係唔可以用bond既real rate直接當做moeny既real rate, 兩個概念黎唔溝得埋
因為money本身假設做冇return, 而bond有return, 而portfolio假設左只可以持有呢兩種財富形式


成個問題應該係, 如果題目問actual cost of holding money, 可唔可以用
actual nominal interest rate去睇, 定係必須要照用expected nominal interest rate睇, 定係兩隻其實概念上冇必別, 仰或數值上兩者其實係相等

real interest rate可以分expected同actual, 咁nominal interest rate又得唔得?
expected nominal interest rate = expected real interest rate + expected inflation rate
咁actual real interest rate + actual inflation rate係咪=actual nominal interest rate??

nominal interest rate 冇分expected同actual

等我幫你清concept啦
嗱，而家你想借錢比人，咁收幾多interest 好？你要訂立一個nominal interest rate, using Fisher Equation:
借錢俾人所訂立的nominal interest rate= 你想收到嘅real interest rate + expected inflation rate

好喇，而家人地還咗錢，你想計下自己收嘅real interest rate 係咪真係你本身想收到嘅real interest rate，using this equation, which IS NOT fisher equation:
realized real interest rate= 訂立左嘅nominal interest rate - actual inflation rate

成個flow就係咁，由頭到尾nominal interest rate 只有一個，就係你自己訂立嗰個～～～～～～～

其實可以當fisher equation有兩條

一條係" 預期版 " 一條係" 真實版 "
預期版' : i = r(e) + △%p (e)
真實版：i =r(a) + △%p(a)
a for actual, e for expected (△%p係通脹率)
咁你做呢d q就只係照單執藥，佢話 expected inflation rate咪△%p (e) 囉。
佢問 real return rate咪 r (a) ,expected ge咪r (e)
唯一要知就人 i仔係 interchangeable in such equations

點解real interest rate可以分actual & expected而nominal interest rate唔得?
所謂冇actual nominal interest rate係咪即係指actual nominal interest rate其實係expected nominal interest rate

借錢比人要簽約（或者agreement啦）年頭定左一個% 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改 唔使分actual/expected nominal interest rate
real有分autual/expected都係因為inflation有actual/expected

如果我借蘋果俾人
年頭定左一個(real)%, 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改, 所以唔使分actual/expected REAL interest rate???

expected即係事前即係今天決定, 如果real interest rate可以今天決定要明天再審視返, 點解nominal interest rate唔得?

巴打concept上好似有啲混淆左兩者
年頭（借錢個時）係份contract到定個個rate一定係nominal interest rate
唔會係real interest rate
你諗下 如果nominal interest rate都可以變 咁fisher equation洗乜搞個real interest rate出黎 直接用nominal加加減減都得啦 就係因為contract/agreement上需要一個唔會變嘅rate(冇理由年頭同人講收10% 年中inflation同佢講哎呀都係要收20% 年尾deflation又轉多次架嘛) 所以先有nominal/real嘅分別

其實可以當fisher equation有兩條

一條係" 預期版 " 一條係" 真實版 "
預期版' : i = r(e) + △%p (e)
真實版：i =r(a) + △%p(a)
a for actual, e for expected (△%p係通脹率)
咁你做呢d q就只係照單執藥，佢話 expected inflation rate咪△%p (e) 囉。
佢問 real return rate咪 r (a) ,expected ge咪r (e)
唯一要知就人 i仔係 interchangeable in such equations

點解real interest rate可以分actual & expected而nominal interest rate唔得?
所謂冇actual nominal interest rate係咪即係指actual nominal interest rate其實係expected nominal interest rate

借錢比人要簽約（或者agreement啦）年頭定左一個% 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改 唔使分actual/expected nominal interest rate
real有分autual/expected都係因為inflation有actual/expected

如果我借蘋果俾人
年頭定左一個(real)%, 年尾就算inflation 100%都冇得改, 所以唔使分actual/expected REAL interest rate???

expected即係事前即係今天決定, 如果real interest rate可以今天決定要明天再審視返, 點解nominal interest rate唔得?

巴打concept上好似有啲混淆左兩者
年頭（借錢個時）係份contract到定個個rate一定係nominal interest rate
唔會係real interest rate
你諗下 如果nominal interest rate都可以變 咁fisher equation洗乜搞個real interest rate出黎 直接用nominal加加減減都得啦 就係因為contract/agreement上需要一個唔會變嘅rate(冇理由年頭同人講收10% 年中inflation同佢講哎呀都係要收20% 年尾deflation又轉多次架嘛) 所以先有nominal/real嘅分別

條式入面既real interest rate係用黎補償你所指既借左出去既錢既購買力(以物品量度), 而expected inflation rate則係用黎補償你所指既借左出去既錢既購買力喺合約期間因為物價水平變動而帶黎既購買力改變

回ir3555巴打
因為冇人借錢簽約嘅時候會用real interest rate嚟做合約條文
例如我借一百蚊比你，規定你一星期後還100蚊+1本經濟書比我
冇人會咁，只會叫你一星期後還100蚊加10蚊比我, nominal interest rate = 10%
dse syllabus 就係冇人會set死個real interest 嚟借錢，at least 銀行/邦民借錢比你唔會










以下內容dse考生睇完就算



當然，for non-dse purpose, 其實現實世界可能真係會set 死real interest rate, 例如上面個例子，real interest set 死左係一本經濟書，咁借錢嗰陣 嗰本經濟書嘅價錢咪就係你嘅 expected nominal interest
而還錢嗰時本經濟書嘅價錢就係你既actual nominal interest

不過！冇錯nominal interet 係可以分expected同real，不過我地無興趣知!因為錢(nominal)係無意思嘅～錢只係用嚟換real嘅嘢( 物質)～～所以我地只係有興趣知expected real and actual real~~

其實答e2 comparative advantage 個陣可唔可以用slope答？之前學校考試咁答個miss比左個？？？我

你答斜d/平d?

唔好啦 點解要咁答

唔洗寫咁多，不過自從呢次之後冇再咁寫過

回ir3555巴打
因為冇人借錢簽約嘅時候會用real interest rate嚟做合約條文
例如我借一百蚊比你，規定你一星期後還100蚊+1本經濟書比我
冇人會咁，只會叫你一星期後還100蚊加10蚊比我, nominal interest rate = 10%
dse syllabus 就係冇人會set死個real interest 嚟借錢，at least 銀行/邦民借錢比你唔會
以下內容dse考生睇完就算
當然，for non-dse purpose, 其實現實世界可能真係會set 死real interest rate, 例如上面個例子，real interest set 死左係一本經濟書，咁借錢嗰陣 嗰本經濟書嘅價錢咪就係你嘅 expected nominal interest
而還錢嗰時本經濟書嘅價錢就係你既actual nominal interest

不過！冇錯nominal interet 係可以分expected同real，不過我地無興趣知!因為錢(nominal)係無意思嘅～錢只係用嚟換real嘅嘢( 物質)～～所以我地只係有興趣知expected real and actual real~~

還一本書係補償你購買力改變, 但係呢本書本身有相對價格對應住既金錢價格, 如果一星期後呢一本書價錢有改變, 你就可能有賺或者有蝕
呢一本書係expected nominal interest, 因為可以拆返開做一本書(預期購買力補償)同呢本書價錢(預期物價補償)
反而係物品個數量正路一般都唔會變(一本書), 而物品個價錢就會有機會變(書既價錢), 咁點解唔值得睇actual cost即係最終書本書數同埋書本價錢最終改變?

除非你當左本書個價錢係不變

書本數量係合約條文set死左，書本價錢先會變～借錢時的書本價錢係expected nominal interet , 還錢時的書本的價錢係actual nominal interest, 但係nominal interest 嘅actual 同 expected , 只係錢～ 經濟學其中一個好重要既野，就係人類make choice 唔係base on 錢(nominal)，而係base on 物質(real)~~~~~你同我講expected nominal interest 係50蚊，而家actual係70蚊，即係本書貴左，但人類冇興趣知，人類只關心呢70蚊可以食到幾多餐飯～可以搭到幾多次巴士～nominal ignores price level, which fails to tell us that~~so we do not want to know nominal interest rate

不如討論下大家最怕咩topic同最中意咩topic 啊

我先 : 最憎
externality (paper 2唔知點答) efficiency ( 好驚佢溝埋d market structure問我d咩mc點解等於 s )

最中意， 成個macro我都中意 係唔中意e2 d咩全球化/ 經濟增長 個d吹水野 ( 成日答錯 )

數據題
雖然得個1-2分,但係寫左唔知自己寫乜鳩

不如討論下大家最怕咩topic同最中意咩topic 啊

我先 : 最憎
externality (paper 2唔知點答) efficiency ( 好驚佢溝埋d market structure問我d咩mc點解等於 s )

最中意， 成個macro我都中意 係唔中意e2 d咩全球化/ 經濟增長 個d吹水野 ( 成日答錯 )

數據題
雖然得個1-2分,但係寫左唔知自己寫乜鳩

Small economy個2幅圖
有時demand/supply shift就唔識
有冇巴打講下

回ir3555巴打
因為冇人借錢簽約嘅時候會用real interest rate嚟做合約條文
例如我借一百蚊比你，規定你一星期後還100蚊+1本經濟書比我
冇人會咁，只會叫你一星期後還100蚊加10蚊比我, nominal interest rate = 10%
dse syllabus 就係冇人會set死個real interest 嚟借錢，at least 銀行/邦民借錢比你唔會
以下內容dse考生睇完就算
當然，for non-dse purpose, 其實現實世界可能真係會set 死real interest rate, 例如上面個例子，real interest set 死左係一本經濟書，咁借錢嗰陣 嗰本經濟書嘅價錢咪就係你嘅 expected nominal interest
而還錢嗰時本經濟書嘅價錢就係你既actual nominal interest

不過！冇錯nominal interet 係可以分expected同real，不過我地無興趣知!因為錢(nominal)係無意思嘅～錢只係用嚟換real嘅嘢( 物質)～～所以我地只係有興趣知expected real and actual real~~

還一本書係補償你購買力改變, 但係呢本書本身有相對價格對應住既金錢價格, 如果一星期後呢一本書價錢有改變, 你就可能有賺或者有蝕
呢一本書係expected nominal interest, 因為可以拆返開做一本書(預期購買力補償)同呢本書價錢(預期物價補償)
反而係物品個數量正路一般都唔會變(一本書), 而物品個價錢就會有機會變(書既價錢), 咁點解唔值得睇actual cost即係最終書本書數同埋書本價錢最終改變?

除非你當左本書個價錢係不變

書本數量係合約條文set死左，書本價錢先會變～借錢時的書本價錢係expected nominal interet , 還錢時的書本的價錢係actual nominal interest, 但係nominal interest 嘅actual 同 expected , 只係錢～ 經濟學其中一個好重要既野，就係人類make choice 唔係base on 錢(nominal)，而係base on 物質(real)~~~~~你同我講expected nominal interest 係50蚊，而家actual係70蚊，即係本書貴左，但人類冇興趣知，人類只關心呢70蚊可以食到幾多餐飯～可以搭到幾多次巴士～nominal ignores price level, which fails to tell us that~~so we do not want to know nominal interest rate

你所指既合約set死書本數量係因為本金係100..........唔係合唔合約既問題...
你借100蚊出去, 一段時間後拎返, 自然要計呢100蚊當下呢一刻既購買力, 再加未來物價改變...
本金講好左, 所以一般黎講物品數量先lock死...


我上面打錯左, 應該係"除非你設定個expected inflation rate係估中左將來actual inflation rate, 咁就冇賺冇蝕, 即係好似"唔洗"考慮個物價變動因為你預知左
名義利率今日決定, 將來物價水平係唔知, 今日就要估埋將來物價...
所以1+R先=(1+r)(1+物價預期改變)

你上面例子咪就係只係考慮左個物品購買力改變....
現實世界借錢還息確係指還錢, 但呢個本金以外既利息唔單係預期通漲通縮..仲可以包埋預期投資賺蝕............

所以我先用蘋果做例子, 因為錢本身自己唔識變多變少...實物應該易睇清楚d成件事...